From: m. nease  <mlnease@y...>
              Date: Thu Oct 12, 2000 9:07am

If it is true that only one citta can arise at a time, doesn't each citta, bearing all the conditions of all previous cittas, have both kusala and akusala characteristics?  If so, than can kusala and akusala arise simultaneously?

Kusala and akusala can never arise together to do their functions, which does not mean that one is temporarily not there, they are, if panna has not eradicated them completely yet (as in the respective levels of ariya puggala) but as latent tendencies, until the right conditions cause them to arise to do their function.  Which is why there are three levels or strengths to the cetasikas, I quote from Khun Sujin's 'Summary', Vipassana (in the advanced section of <http://www.dhammastudy.com>):

There are 3 levels of kilesa namely, anusaya-kilesa,   pariyutthana-kilesa and Vitikkakama-kilesa.

Vitikkakama-kilesa is the coarse kilesa, causing one to break the sila (precepts) and perform duccarita kamma (wrong action)     physically or verbally.  To virati is to refrain from       Vitikkakama-kilesa with sila.

Pariyutthana-kilesa is the medium kind of kilesa that arises with akusala-citta but not to the point of breaking the sila and     performing duccarita kamma.  To refrain from pariyutthana-kilesa momentarily is called vikkhambhana-pahana with jhana-kusala-citta.

Anusaya-kilesa is a very fine kilesa.  When kilesa has not been
eradicated, the anusaya-kilesa would settle like sediment in the
cittas that arise and fall away in continuation, like a seed, a
paccaya for pariyutthana-kilesa to arise.  All kilesa would be
completely eradicated, never to arise again, when the
lokuttara-magga-citta clearly realizes the ariya-sacca-dhamma by experiencing the characteristics of nibbana according to the levels of the magga-citta, which completely eradicates kilesa according to the levels of the specific magga-citta.

Before the enlightenment of the Buddha there were people who
observed the precepts, abstaining from wrong doing and developing samatha-bhavana unto the arupa-jhana of the highest level, the nevasannanasannayatana-jhana and temporarily suppressed kilesa as vikkhambhana-pahana.  But none were able to eradicate anusaya-kilesa.

When the Buddha had accumulated his parami for four asankheyya and a hundred thousand kappa, he became enlightened of the anuttarasammasambodhinana (the supreme omniscient self-enlightenment) as the Sammasambuddha the Arahanta.  He manifested the way to practice towards the realization of the ariya-sacca-dhamma so that there were many ariya-sankha-savaka (disciples) who attained the ariya-sacca-dhamma, eradicating kilesa.  As long as there are those who study and practice the dhamma according to what he became enlightened with and manifested in detail all through 45 years, they continue to do so.  The dhamma manifested by the Buddha is refined, intricate, and profound because he manifested the characteristics of realities with which he became enlightened by having fully realized the truth about the             specific realities.  Any who do not conscientiously study the dhamma he manifested to rightly understand it, would not be able to develop panna to fully realize the characteristics of realities and be able to eradicate kilesa.

For panna to be able to fully realize the characteristics of
realities as they really are, there must be right understanding     from the start what are the realities that panna would fully realize the truth about: which is all that are real, that are appearing through the eyes, ears, nose, tongue, bodysense and mind at this very moment.

It means that when there is seeing, hearing, smelling, tasting,
knowing bodysense contact and thinking, there is no knowledge of the true characteristics of realities as they truly are.  The Buddha manifested the realities that arise, appear and evolve through the eyes, ears, nose, tongue, bodysense and mind every day at each instant in detail, so one might see the harm of akusala-dhamma and samsara-vatta.  Since one does not see the harm, one would not endeavor and persist in developing vipassana, which is the panna that fully realizes the characteristics of realities appearing as they truly are normally until kilesa can be eradicated.

The development of samatha-bhavana and that of vipassana-bhavana differ in the aramana and the levels of panna.  The former has aramana which render the mahakusala-nana-sampayutta-citta peaceful upon contemplation until it is steadily and uniquely based on a          unique arammana. Vipassana-bhavana has paramattha-aramana, namely nama-dhamma and rupa-dhamma, that arise, appear and fall away as aramana, which the mahakusala-nana-sampayutta-citta begin to take        note of, examine arammana by arammana, regularly, constantly until it knows that they are realities that are not entities, persons, or the selves.  The result of samatha-bhavana is to be born a brahma-puggala in the brahma-bhumi. The result of vipassana-bhavana is that panna, fully realizes the characteristics of realities as they truly are and eradicates kilesa completely according to the level of lokuttara-magga-citta with nibbana as arammana unto the level of arahanta-magga-citta, which completely eradicates all kilesa so samsara-vatta would end with no more rebirth.

Those who develop vipassana-bhavana must be straight and true and know that they still have all the kilesa.  They must not desire to eradicate lobha first, because the ordinary person cannot precipitate to being an arahanta immediately because they must first eradicate the lobha that arises with sakkayaditthi, that clings to realities that arise concurrently as the selves, entities and people.  Only then would other kilesa be eradicated in sequence, respectively.

Since one does not know that the instant of seeing is not the self,
entity or person, how can one abandon kilesa, or its effects?  The same applies to hearing, smelling, tasting, and knowing bodysense contact.

Each reality arises, falls away and disappearing completely very
rapidly at all times.  The Buddha manifested the way to practice to develop panna to realize the truth about realities: that there is only one way, the development of the eightfold ariya-magga namely samma-ditthi (panna-cetasika), samma-sankappa (vitaka-cetasika), samma-vaca (samma-vaca-cetasika), samma-kammanta (samma-kammanta-cetasika), samma-ajiva (samma-ajiva-cetasika), samma-vayama (viriya-cetasika), samma-sati (sati-cetasika) samma-samadhi (ekaggata-cetasika).

At first, before the lokuttara-citta arises, the fivefold path
(excluding the virati because virati arise one at a time, the 3
 virati-cetasika will arise concurrently only in the lokuttara-citta) would arise and perform their functions together in the instant that sati is mindful of the characteristics of realities that are either nama-dhamma or rupa-dhamma, through the eyes, ears, nose, tongue, bodysense or mind.  And the panna-cetasika that arises concurrently with samma-sati at that instant would start to take note, examine and know the characteristics of the specific nama-dhamma or      rupa-dhamma  little by little, regularly and constantly until there is clear knowledge whether it is nama-dhamma or rupa-dhamma.

Realities that appear through the eyes, ears, nose, tongue,
bodysense and mind are categorized as the 4 sati-patthana.  When sati arises to be mindful of the characteristics of distinct
realities as

1) Kayanupassana-satipatthana: whenever sati arises to be mindful of the characteristics of rupa through the bodysense, it is kayanupassana-satipatthana.

2) Vedananupassana-satipatthana: whenever sati arises to be mindful of the characteristics of feelings that appear, it is
vedananupassana-satipatthana.

3) Cittanupassana-satipatthana: whenever sati arises to be mindful of the characteristics of distinct kinds of citta, it is
cittanupassana-satipatthana.

4) Dhammanupassana-satipatthana: whenever sati arises to be mindful of the characteristics of the rupa-dhamma or nama-dhamma, it is dhammanupassana-satipatthana.

The word satipatthana has 3 meanings:

1) Satipatthana is the paramattha-arammana or nama-dhamma  and rupa-dhamma that sati is mindful of (the 4 satipatthana).

2) Satipatthana is the sati-cetasika that arises with
kamavacara-nanasampayutta-citta that is mindful of the arammana that are satipatthana.

3) Satipatthana is the path taken by the Sammasambuddha the Arahanta and the ariya-savanna.

It is extremely difficult and infrequent for the eight ariya-magga
or the development of the 4 satipatthana to be mindful of the
characteristics of each reality that arises and appears through
the eyes, ears, nose, tongue, bodysense and mind each day to arise, according to the causes: avijja, lobha and all the akusala-dhamma accumulated over such a long period of time in the samsara-vatta, even including this lifetime each day since our birth.  Those who understand the causes and results of realities as they truly are would therefore be persistent in listening to, studying and examining the dhamma to understand about realities through the eyes, ears, nose, tongue, bodysense and mind until it becomes paccaya to compose satipatthana to arise and to be correctly mindful, take note, examine and study the characteristics of the realities appearing according to what one has heard and understood.

All dhamma, including satipatthana and the eightfold ariya-magga, are anatta.  They could arise when there are paccaya or when the mahakusala-nana-sampayutta has been sufficiently accumulated, there would be no more turning towards other practices than mindfulness, noting and examining nama-dhamma and rupa-dhamma that is appearing through the eyes, ears, nose, tongue, bodysense and mind.
(End quote.)
 

             Finally:  Occuring for such an infinitesimally brief
              period, does all of this really matter, for practical
              purposes?  Or is this only of theoretical importance?
 

It is essential if one wants to know the truth about things, which
for an eternity has never been taught.  Again, nothing is lost, so
in fact these tiny instants can actually eradicate an eternity of
wrong view when accumulated to certain level, which is a wonderous discovery, because there is no other way at all!  For me personally I prefer to live with knowledge of things as they really are, even if it is only in tiny instants, rather than in complete ignorance and illusion.  I do not expect immediate results, but at least there is a glimmer of light in that direction and if we walk one step at a time we are sure to reach it one day, and I am secure in the knowledge that this path leads me to selflessness, and any freedom from the self is always kusala both for myself and for other people. Reading this now with the self may be discouraging, 'when am I ever going to reach this or that impossibly far off goal, what are my accumulations exactly, what if all my efforts are in vain?'

But in reality whether we know it or not, they are all thoughts
arising from seeing for passing instants 'vanno' through the eyes, followed by long trains of thoughts interposed by bhavanga, more sight, plus other nama and rupa arising.  These are all real and we do not know their true nature without studying them, and studying them is the only way, according to the Buddha, to accumulate knowledge about them to such a degree that it could free you from all ignorance and kilesa.  It may seem an impossibly difficult and long term project, but one must start somewhere and why not know that it can arise at any time and place and study as often as sati can arise?  The Buddha spent impossibly long eons studying also, ever since he was predicted by the Buddha Dipankara to be a future Buddha four assankhaya and a hundred thousand kappa ago.  The dhamma
is not easy, in fact Khun Sujin said to say that it is hard is to
appreciate the wisdom of the Buddha.

This is why he exhorted us to be brave and cheerful, and have viriya or perseverence against all odds, so that we live in knowledge of things as they really are and could reach the ultimate knowledge one day, after all we must all have very good accumulations to have found his teachings and kalayanamitta along the way.  It is an ultimately lonely path that each must walk alone, but while we are in such company it is both beneficial and encouraging, after all the sasana is still there to lead us to the truth and freedom.

              From:   <kom@a...>
              Date: Sun Oct 15, 2000 11:22pm
              Subject: Accumulations-continued

 ...The book mentioned that Anusaya kilesa cannot "normally" be detected by anyone (except perhaps the Samasambuddha???).  We know that anusaya kilesa is also accumulated.  Now, this begs the question, how and where is anusaya kilesa accumulated?...

Let us go back to the fact that all dhamma in the world or outside it would have to be one of the four paramatthadhamma, namely citta, cetasika, rupa and nibbana.  Rupa and nibbana aside, the 'intelligence or the dhatu that knows and experiences' in other words the nama, can be classified as citta or cetasika.

The citta is the principle faculty of experience, from the most
minute details in human sight to the deepest thoughts, from mixed aromas to the tiniest vibrations.  The cetasika do all the other functions: like or dislike, remember, study.  Citta and cetasika must always arise together, inseparably.  The citta is a constant, its characteristic of all experiencing is the same no matter the kind of cetasika accompanies it, which is why, when one studies the ayatana it is considered the inner one, and the cetasika the outer.  But in most places although both elements are without shape and form of any kind, the cetasika is refered to as 'born in the citta', which is to say again it never arises with anything else, ever.

If it were to have some sort of shape, however, one might think of a big pot with the 52 cetasika like 'sediment' at the bottom until some condition makes some rise up in a bubble, big or small, when the pot boils or cools.  Say we have gas pellets of different kinds and colors and they react differently to just water, cold or hot, others that react to heat, and still others that react to the cold, so different sets will combine to make different bubbles.  Some of the 52 cetasika that accompanies the citta will accompany all citta, some cannot arise together in the same citta, because they are opposed (lobha and dosa for example) always when it is hot or cold some will remain inactive since they only react to one or the other, never to both.  Whatever rises to the surface can be detected, while the rest lie 'dormant' until the conditions are right for them to rise too.  (This is my very own invention and my responsibility if     anyone gets even more confused- but the word 'sediment' in the quotation about the anusaya kilesa gave me the idea.)

My point is that the citta holds the 'seeds' of all 52 cetasika and
when there are conditions, certain sets would arise and do their duty while others settle like 'sediment' at the bottom, and when the citta falls away and conditions the next citta to arise, with all the accumulations of the past, in the different combinations as well as the strengths and weaknesses of the cetasika passed on.  Of course not all cetasika are anusaya or even kilesa, some are just operational, such as passa or jivitindriya and arise with all citta, even when all kilesa has been eradicated, as in the arahanta.

For example as we said elsewhere for the vipaka and its condition, the computer is composed of 1 and 0 in eight positions, and the possibility of these two numbers in only eight positions yeilds over 10 million posibilities.  Just think of the possible combinations of the 52 cetasika in at least 7 positions (since the 7 sappa-citta-satarana-cetasika of the 13 annasamana arise for all) plus the lowest number of the akusala possible, or the lowest number of the kusala possible (which is higher than for the akusala since the good is harder to do), each cetasika with different strength.  Indeed we might say that the citta is the most powerful computer in the world, nothing is ever lost, they just wait their turn when the right conditions come.  The only exception of course is when panna is strong enough to end it all.
 

            From: m. nease  <mlnease@y...>
              Date: Mon Oct 16, 2000 4:48pm
              Subject: Re: [DhammaStudyGroup]
              Re: Accumulations-continued

 ...So:  The cetasika are not actually accumulated, or conditioned (in the same sense that the citta are)--they become active dependent on the accumulations of the (past and present) citta--is this right?...
 

Some of the cetasika function at all times, to use a medical       analogy, like your heart and lungs.  Other organs may have periods of rest, but the moment these two stop altogether it is the end of that lifetime. The sappa citta satarana cetasika (cetasika common to all citta) and the citta is even more continuously arising and falling away, through samsara, until panna is able to stop them forever.  The cuti citta or the citta that performs the function of passing on to the next life passes on all the accumulations to the next citta or the patisandhi citta (birth citta) which is a vipaka citta since at that time it is the result of some former kamma, no new ones are possible yet.  But all the accumulations of endless lifetimes that has not resulted yet or has not finished yeilding results and that are ready to do so will function to determine from the color of your hair to the shape of your toenails (you're right, it is reminiscent of genes or even DNA) to whether you will live an eternity (like the Brahma) or the lifespan of a fruitfly.  Or whether you will hear the dhamma or not (think of the Buddha's teachers Aralatapas and Utakatapas!) in that lifetime.

One of the sappa-citta-satarana-cetasika is cetana cetasika (intention or volition) which is the main cause of accumulations.  It functions at different levels of strength, much like the kilesa, for example when it arises with vipaka (which arises to receive the result of past kamma), it is imperceptible, just helping the citta to experience the vipaka arising.  It does not accumulate anything further.

Its characteristics show when there is intention to do something and the attempt to do it.  An extreme example is when Devadata tried to assasinate the Buddha and the monstruosity of the cetana was such that even though the Buddha had no accumulations to die that way, the vipaka of the cetana was immediate and resulted in his death and sufferings in hell soon after.  Khun sujin says that whatever you intend for other people is accumulated for you yourself in your own citta, whether the other people had the accumulation to suffer from   your intentions or not.  This is indeed feeding the gass pellets in enormous quantities.

In between there are the normal daily accumulation, usually lobha, such as liking a pretty flower, you may not even want it
but it is like a pianist who practices, you could get better or
remain the same, depending.  But it is also impossible to live
without lobha (except for the arahanta, and then they no longer come back to be), can you give up your eyes and ears now, never to read or hear about even the dhamma again?  It is also one of the reasons for your smile, although the other reasons for it, for example piti in learning the truth, could lead you to another sort of smile, unique to the arahanta!
 

              From: A T  <axtran@h...>
              Date: Fri Oct 20, 2000 6:19am
              Subject: Re: [DhammaStudyGroup]
              Re: praise (Was meditation, hatred ,and fear)

...I understand that whatever the Arahant goes through such as aging, or getting sick is due to the left over vipaka that He created before attaining Arahantship...
 
 

According to Khun Sujin during today's discussion, the arahanta has eradicated all kilesa, so to continue the analogy (with my witch's brew luckily coincidental with the holiday spirit of Halloween), panna has grown so strong that it expulses all bad cetasika from the cauldron so that what remains are the good ones and the operational or automatic ones.  From then on with no self to feed the gas pellets with kusala and akusala, since even mana is gone, all actions turn to kiriya which replace the kusala and akusala, and therefore all their cetana is fruitless, no matter how splendid the intention or volition.  That is why where normally the last citta before the cuti citta would be kusala or akusala, which brings results as the patisandhi citta of the next lifetime, for the arahanta the last citta before cuti would be kiriya that brings no results whatever.  The citta has stopped passing on the contents of the pot to the next one.  In the meantime, before the parinibbana occurs, there would be kiriya with sobhana or asobhana cetasika (but of course no more akusala possible) arising concurrently.  Khun Sujin asked for example whether the arahanta would need panna to bathe as opposed to teaching the dhamma.  (What a wonderful life it must be never to worry if what one does could be wrong, aside from the fact that one is freed from the senseless samsara forever!  And most importantly from one's 'self'!!)